Re: Locate Portal spell - Dreamer's hacked version has errors

In <URL:news:local.spelljam> on Sat 01 Apr, Peter Aronson wrote:
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Dreamer" <dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk>
> To: <SPELLJAMMER-L@??????.???????.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 1:46 AM
> Subject: Re: [SPELLJAMMER] Locate Portal spell - Dreamer's hacked version
> has errors
> 
> > It depends on what you think of 'Wildspace Rangers'; you could
> > argue that this spell fits with the idea of tracking in space,
> > etc. You need to think about what the character class does, in
> > particular in a SJ setting, in addition to their existing spell
> > lists.
> 
> I think Wildspace Rangers would be a neat idea, but I think clearly regular
> rangers wouldn't get this spell.

This is the old problem of Character Class boundaries - where
does what a character wants to do (or what a player wants to do
with their character) change so much that they should be a
different class?

OK, a group of adventurers who were groundlings get out into
wildspace, then the Flow, via one of the classic SJ campaign
start-up options. One of them is a Ranger, and after adjusting to
the fact of not doing everything on the ground starts to think in
terms of Survival in wildspace, and how you move around unnoticed
there, spot other people who are attempting such, and track,
using knowledge of where people have to go (such as portals or
air sources, corresponding to mountain passes or water holes), etc.

Does this Ranger just learn a few new skills and feats, and maybe
appropriate SJ spells, or do they have to become a different
character class, say a 'Wildspace Rangers', to be able to
function effectively as anything other than a Fighter in a SJ
setting?

I'd prefer to avoid forcing that Ranger to take a new character
class, as in general I'd prefer to avoid forcing new clases on
characters who want to become effective in a SJ setting.


> > > Should read: "Casting Time: 10 minutes"
> >
> > I realise that to convert the spell, time to time, 1 DnD turn
> > becomes 10 3rdEd minutes, but if you want the spell to take the
> > same number of combat actions, which I think is arguably the
> > intention, then the Casting Time should be 1 minute.
> >
> > This is a problem which will come up again and again - if we
> > convert on just the basis of the length of time that DnD turns
> > last we will get spells that no one will contemplate casting in a
> > combat sitation.
> >
> > I'd prefer the time frame for spells to match the original, but
> > if people think the spell should become something more like a ten
> > minute ritual?
> 
> This bothers me too.  A lot of the spells in the Spelljammer books seem to
> have very arbitary casting times, and it seems to me that looking for
> equivalent spells at 3.0e/3.5e and seeing what their casting time is, is as
> least as legitimate.

It is the traditional problem of trying to convert something
between two systems without being able to pick the brains of the
original authors (assuming they could remember! [grin] ).

I prefer a functional approach, on the basis of what the spell
was (likely) used for in the SJ setting, and trying to ensure you
do not significantly change the usability (either positive or
negative).

If these spells were (looked at from a character viewpoint)
researched at some point then you don't know what spells were
used as a basis, and whether the casting time was something the
researcher worked hard to get what they wanted, or just accepted
what came out, as it seemed workable. A difficult problem.


> > So:
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> > Cleric Spells
> >
> > 2nd-Level Cleric Spells
> > Locate Portal - Senses direction and distance of closest portal
> > in the adjacent crystal shell.
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> This is not a Clerical spell of any level in Concordance of Arcane Spell -- 
> is it somewhere else?

No, but adding a Clerical Domain to it, like 'Wildspace', implies
that it might be available to some 3rdEd Clerics. I was just
trying to add the extra entry, and use this as an example of my
suggested changed text.


> > Unfortunately, I think this needs more work before it is agreed
> > on...
> 
> I am beginning to think that this project is going to call for an editor to
> make final decisions.  I don't think complete agreement is going to occur,
> in part because some of the decisions will be at their heart matters of
> taste rather than matters of fact.
> 
> Personally, all I want out of this project is an additional spell list I can
> put in my campaign information binder for my players to look at when
> choosing spells, just like the skills and feats section on Beyond the Moons
> for when they are choosing skills and feats.

I want something that is usable, with minimum changes, so I can
use my current knowledge of 2ndEd SJ as far as possible while
doing 3rdEd.


> Best Regards,
> 
> Peter

-- 
Dreamer
dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk
http://www.romsys.demon.co.uk/