Re: Whatever happened to the 3.5e conversions to the Spelljammer Spells?

In <URL:news:local.spelljam> on Wed 29 Mar, Peter Aronson wrote:
> > Dreamer wrote:
> > Am I by being too optimistic by suggesting that attempts be made
> > to agree on a minimum core set of spells?
> >
> > I'm guessing that the spells that make (temporary) helms,
> > replenish air (on a smallish scale), and deal with being in a
> > crystal sphere foreign to your god/divine focus are the minimum.
> 
> I'd also include the portal spells here: Locate Portal and Create Portal.

Probably needed, assuming that there isn't a mundane way of
spotting them, or that anywhere on the shell can be passed as a
portal, both of which anyway would probably only apply to some
crystal spheres.

Maybe we should throw in standard magic items, like the Portal
Compass (obvious function), and the Portal Lantern, which shines
a big circle of light on a shell, which then acts as a portal?

I also always thought things like Air Candles were an obvious
addition to SJ, given reasonable alchemy. (Obvious problems in
the Flow! [grin] ) This might fit the 3rdEd style of various
standard alchemical items for common sale. "Getting a bit stuffy
in here, lads. Shall I light another candle?" [grin]


> > Loki wrote:
> > My suggestion is this: that we break them up according to
> > waht product they originally apppeared in (with another
> > category for new ones). It would mae for a more logical
> > division. Personally I would classify the ones from CoAS
> > as the "core," spells so useful and common that parrallel
> > lines of arcane research have developed them in most SJ
> > capable/based societies. Much like cure lt. wounds and
> > magic missile are to groundlings.
> 
> This seems like a sensible proposal.  So there would be the following
> sections of spells:
> 
> (1) Spells from Concordance of Arcane Space
> (2) Spells from Lost Ships
> (3) Spells from Astromundi Cluster
> (4) Spells from Adventure Modules
> (5) Contributed Spells

Sounds good!


> We would have to choose among the various conversions: Richard Gant's, the
> ones on the Shattered Fractine, Alexander James' -- they're all a bit
> different.  Also, no one has yet posted a detailed conversion of Detect
> Powers, but then, the original in CoAS is a horrible mix of player and GM
> information that really should have been two separate sections.
> 
> On the other hand, I really like Mark Doolan's Stellar and Wildspace Domains
> in the Shattered Fractine version.  However, they both rely on spells not
> from the Spelljammer books.  But they seem much more in the spirit of 3.5e.
> I suppose the combination could be worked out, but it'd make the rules
> messier.  (David Shepheard has also proposed some Clerical Domains -- 
> Spelljamming, Sphere, Wildspace and Vacuum -- but they don't appear to be as
> completely worked out.)

Domains are a nice idea, but I would recommend leaving them out
of the base spell rules, to avoid any more detail than is needed.

Maybe Domains could be listed separately, in case DMs wish to use
them?


> We would also need to come to some sort of agreement on which Spelljamming
> spells are available for:
> 
> Bards
> Druids
> Paladins
> Rangers
> Warmages
> 
> (OK, Warmages are probably not strictly necessary, but they're easy.  Wu Jen
> would be a bit more work.)  Also, would Adepts get any Spelljamming spells?

Again, for simplicity, write up the spells just for wizards and
priests. Each other class can have its own mini section, listing
just a minimum of info, maybe like the PHB. Yes, this means that
the cross-referencing only goes one-way, but it ensures
simplicity.


> Someone suggested we go through the spells one at a time and discuss them.
> Let's start with the first spell in CoAS: Locate Portal.  I'll assume that
> at least for the spells in CoAS that people have access to the originals,
> and just post existing conversions.
> 
> Richard Gant:
> 
> Locate Portal
> Divination
> Level: Sor/Wiz 2
> Components:  V, S, M
> Casting Time:  1 round
> Range:  Personal
> Duration:  Instantaneous
> Saving Throw:  None
> Spell Resistance:  No
>      This spell, which may only be cast at medium range (100 ft. + 10
> ft./level) to a crystal shell, informs the caster of the distance in miles
> and the direction to the nearest natural portal through that crystal shell.
> In general, from any point on a crystal shell, the portals for a
> normal-sized ship are 2d10 days away from a ship's current location.
> 
>      Material Component:  A conch shell.

This looks OK, but I don't see why the casting time should drop
from one turn to one round - I would guess that this is orginally
not a spell intended for combat casting.

I'm not sure about the range being reduced, as needing to get
within a minimum of 130 ft (i.e. 3rd level) of a crystal shell in
a large ship, maybe travelling at speed, instead of the 300 ft of
the original spell, could be a bit risky.

This spell also loses the 'knowing the ship travel time' option
of the original spell. But, if it didn't, would this be travel in
a straight line, "as the crow flies", or along the surface of the
shell, or what?

It also assumes (as does the original) that a mile is a unit of
measurement that makes sense to the caster of the spell. Maybe
more useful would be how long it would take them to walk, in
days, along the sphere surface, maybe assuming 10hr days and a
man normally does about 3mls/hr? 25mls/day? Or, can you use
Overdrive to get to portals? Or, is 'miles' something used so the
players and DM don't need to worry about more detail in the game
than is needed?

And, this version only detects natural, not all, portals.


(Incidentally, does being near a crystal sphere shell drop you
out of Overdrive? I don't recall seeing the answer to this
anywhere. I _assume_ most ships slow down to tactical speed, just
a few tens of mph, on entering or leaving spheres, just in case
they need to change direction fast. But, does ramming the shell
at Overdrive speed safely drop you to tactical speed, or splatter
you? If splatter, given Overdrive speed, and human reaction
times, how far away from the shell should you brake to tactical
for safety? If splatter, how far away can a lookout spot a (dark)
shell? Or, can the Helmsman tell the shell is near and safely
deal with all this? Is stop/splatter crystal sphere dependent?
... Just Asking ... )



> Mark Doolan:
> 
> Locate Portal
> Divination
> Level: Sor/Wiz 2, Wildspace 1
> Components: V, S and M
> Casting Time 1 minute
> Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft. /level)
> Target: Crystal shere
> Duration: See text
> Saving Throw: None
> Spell Resistance: No
> 
> 
>     This spell only works when within range of the surface of a Crystal
> Sphere. The caster of a locate portal can find the nearest portal through
> the crystal shell either into or out of the Flow (phlogiston). The spell
> indicates direction and distance (either in miles or in travel time, should
> the wizard know the particulars of his own ship).
> 
>     In general, from any point in the crystal shell, a portal suitable for a
> normal sizes ship can be found within 2-20 days travel. At the DM's option,
> there may be more portals available, fewer or not at all.
> 
>     Material Component: A conch shell.

An OK description, but it needs spellchecking.

I don't think having extra Domains on standard spell descriptions
is a good idea.

The range looks OK.

The 'Duration' is not really explained in the text - does the
spell continue running until you reach the portal, instead of
just giving an instantaneous range and direction?

As above (lengthy discussion), 'miles' as a unit of measurement
might be questionable.


> Alexander James listed this spell, but didn't post a description.
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> Peter

-- 
Dreamer
dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk
http://www.romsys.demon.co.uk/