Re: Steampunk Jammer

In <URL:news:local.spelljam> on Sun 31 Jul, Scratch wrote:
> >There should be renegade mages among the steampunk nation - not
> >everyone will be willing to be trained as an engineer, and the
> >magical talent in some will be so strong it cannot be suppressed.
> >Another alternative is engineers who have an unconscious magical
> >talent which makes machinery work, even though it really
> >shouldn't - such might be highly prized.
>
> Well, there are. Problem is that the nation requires all mages to be
> licensed and pay taxes (being a walking deadly weapon and all). A major
> boon to small time mages who are trying to make it. As far as the
> unconscious magic thing, that's a pretty good idea. Might really  help with
> the alchemical thing.

I know people who played adventuring Alchemists as a player
character class since the late 1970s, using the rules in an early
"Dragon" magazine - arguably they work best as a split/dual/multi
class with something like Bard, or maybe Priest. There are some
bits developed over the last 30+yrs at:

http://www.romsys.demon.co.uk/frpg/alchemy/


> >Big airships are one of the things that people tend to associate
> >with steampunk, maybe along with things like telegraphs. Magic
> >might be ignored, but alchemy might have government support, so
> >you might have golems and other alchemical constructs. You might
> >also want to think about religion, and whether the shift away
> >from magic has affected priestly miracles - what is the style of
> >priestly magic (if any)? Is there a state religion? Steampunk
> >frequently has things like strange patent medicines - some of
> >these might actually work, via alchemy, giving an alternative to
> >clerical healing. You probably want to think carefully about what
> >explosives are in use - I don't recommend more than blackpowder/
> >smokepowder.
>
> I don't know about telegraphs, but I totally forgot about airships, that's
> definitely a must. Just one question, why no smoke powder?

Smokepowder allows explosives to enter the game, which is a major
change in the amount of force that can be applied without magic
(unless you count ramming). It is just that I would recommend not
having anything better than smokepower, or at least that is what
a look at the RW history of explosives suggests to me.

You might want to think carefully about telegraphs, as they
introduce cheap and accurate long distance communication,
something that really changes a culture. Terry Pratchett's
"Discworld" stories have recently shown what can be done with
just mechanical semaphores and the right (or wrong) attitude -
clever use of signal fires/smoke, or more powerfully heliographs,
can do quite a lot.


> As far as religion goes I'm thinking something along the lines of ancestor
> worship or a belief in a godless reincarnation. I'm just not sure and I
> haven't gone so far as to research either. But as far as I know, neither
> one exists without some sort of pantheon. I have to give this some more
> thought.

Look at Shinto, or Buddhism - if your ancestor does well enough
(or maybe was important enough before death), or you are really
good at reincarnation (or inspire enough people), then it may be
very difficult to tell the result from at least demi-gods. Once
you get a heirarchy those further up the ladder may well assume
god-like attributes.

Now, if your democratic militarism extends to the afterlife, then
the idea might be that some spirits are in elected positions of
power, or have certain jobs as a result of being skillful at them
that give them more power. Praying to divine union leaders? [grin]

Maybe their idea is that the afterlife just gets on with itself,
and you have your funerals and baptisms, to celebrate people
entering and leaving life, maybe with the occasional memorial
service, but nothing else. "Maybe we will meet in our next
lives?" [grin]

It could be that the idea is that you do as good a job as
possible at being whatever your life has led you to, and,
eventually, you get to leave the Wheel Of Incarnation, and ascend
to a higher, unknown, plane of existence.

Whatever produces the right results for your campaign!


> >How much is magic effected by the belief of the people, in your
> >world? If magic is believed to be weak and primitive, then you
> >might put a penalty of -1 level of (conscious) magic use in towns
> >beyond a certain size, -2 levels in cities, maybe even -3 levels
> >in the capital city. This penalty might be even worse if someone
> >was doing magical research. This would mean anyone involved in
> >magic in the steampunk nation would be in out-of-the-way places,
> >with few locals around.
>
> Hm, would that be a penalty against the spell level or the actual success
> of casting the spells?

I was thinking more the caster level, which means less than a 4th
level caster will be incapable of anything but cantrips in the
capital city. High level casters may loose access to their most
powerful spells, and have reduced effect on the ones they can
still cast, but are still useful to have around.


> >Is planar access limited in the steampunk nation - maybe in
> >similar ways to magic use being restricted? Even so, are there
> >any extra planar entities around, stirring the pot, such as
> >demons or devils which have aspects tied to the abuse of
> >technology, or the nasty living conditions that tend to come with
> >an industrial revolution? Might there be a divine avatar or two,
> >trying to make things better?
>
> That would definitely work. I imagine some demon selling snake oil remedies
> that cause possession or a plague. Great idea for an adventure. As far as
> divinities though, I doubt there would be one since as I mentioned above
> they don't have a true god-worshipping religion. So demons slip in, but
> divinities can't or wont.

Avatars might well be able to go places that the gods have little
or no power, and servants of the gods can act even if they
receive no benefit from their gods in terms of magic. There might
well be multiple attempts in progress to try and start (or
restart) religions. If there were god wars back in history, and
the people turned against gods in general, you might use this to
explain the current beliefs. Maybe they have Faith Police? [grin]


> >Banking might be more significant, as someone has to finance
> >things, and some merchants might have become very powerful. What
> >is the state of manufacturing, in terms of household goods like
> >cloth and pottery? Also, are steam-powered tractors in use for
> >agriculture (which makes a lot of difference to food production)?
> >Chemical fertilizers? Weed killers? Food preservation techniques
> >such as canning? Chemical dyes? Are there any true scientists, or
> >is everything done by trial-and-error, without a systematic
> >approach?
>
> Hm as far as steam powered tractors goes, I'm sure they could have that.
> But it would prolly be something very craftsman orientated since I don't
> think they would be in the full swing of a industrial revolution.
> Definitely no real chemicals or pesticides. Maybe they could have
> somethings they found out of trial and error. There would be very few real
> scientists, but they would be increasing gradually.

It is possible that scientists are treated in the same way as
priests of gods, people with a strong belief in the Scientific
Method, and the sacred Null Hypothesis, and this is one reason
they are uncommon, and treated with suspicion.

I think you can go a long way with trial-and-error, and a bit of
luck, in a craftman orientated set-up, as long as the skills are
passed on effectively. This probably means open training, without
guild secrets, which in the RW some people believe hindered
progress in medieval times.


> >Steam-powered combat robots, with intelligence provided by the
> >alchemically preserved and re-activated brains of dead
> >soldiers...
>
> Enter the tinker gnomes. :P

You don't need these to get really messy things going on, and any
sensible craft-based society will treat anything they do with a
lot of suspicion. You wonder just how common "Death By Innovation"
is among them...


> >Just a few random thoughts...
>
> That was more then random I think. Thanks you helped a lot.

We aim to confuse! Or, was that help? Anyhow, glad to be of
assistance!

--
Dreamer
dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk
http://www.romsys.demon.co.uk/