Re: Brass heads and wizards - Was: Why is it 'Grey' and 'Realm' space?

In <URL:news:local.spelljam> on Mon 07 Mar, David Shepheard wrote:
> From: "Dreamer" <dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk>
> Subject: Re: [SPELLJAMMER] Why is it 'Grey' and 'Realm' space?
>
>
> > In <URL:news:local.spelljam> on Wed 02 Mar, David Shepheard wrote:
> > > From: "Dreamer" <dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk>
> > > Subject: [SPELLJAMMER] Why is it 'Grey' and 'Realm' space?
> >
> > > The Brass Head is fun. I'd be interested to see what these devices can
> > > do. Does it connect to the mind of a god or outer plane creature?
> >
> > The idea is from the real world character, Roger Bacon, who
> > allegedly made a Brass Head that would answer questions. Some
> > sort of advanced Contact Higher Planes would be the easy way to
> > make it, maybe connecting to some extra-universal principle of
> > Knowledge would be more interesting, with some major ritual
> > required. Like you having to construct a new library, of a
> > variety not known on that world, and bringing knowledge together
> > in a new way.
> >
> > The original Brass Head (from probably faulty memory) could
> > answer three questions, I think one about the past, one the
> > present, and one the (possible?) future. But, if you say that you
> > can get elaborate answers, and the Head will expand on things it
> > has already said, it's a lot more worthwhile using than something
> > like Legend Lore.
>
> The (3e) DMG has got some rules about intelligent magical items
> (and how their ego can expand and make them want to be in
> charge). I think that it would be worth you reading through them.
> You could turn the brass head into an NPC with its own adgenda.
> (Have you ever seen the British sci-fi TV show called Blakes 7?
> That had a really intelligent, but really aragant computer in it
> called Orac. Orac could make a good model for something like a
> Brass Head if you wanted to make it taunt players or make them do
> things for it before helping.)

Looking carefully at the DnD 3rdEd rules is one of the things on
my 'to do' list, but, I've not yet run or played in any campaigns
using these rules, so I don't have that much motivation.

The regular games that I'm in use what is effectively AD&D 1stEd,
with frequent nods to Original D&D! Quite a lot of the characters
don't even have NWP worked out, and some don't even bother with
WP! Still, it is the quality of the ref that counts.

I've occasionally thought seriously about converting bits of SJ
that are useful to me into Hero System (4th or 5th Ed), as I've
used spelljammers in some cross-over games, but, this looks even
less likely than me converting all my stuff to DnD 3rdEd! [grin]

So, I'm inclined to make things I write a bit rules mechanics
light, so they can be easily adapted to whatever games system.


My initial idea for the Brass Head was that it was a one-off
question-answering ritual, which fitted the wizard's interest in
automata. Hence, it would not have any ego or mind of its own. It
is possible that the force answering the questions might change
this, though, maybe because it doesn't think the library offered
was good enough. So, you could develop something Orac-like
(rather than the more agreeable Zen, or even the grovelling Slave
AI).


> > > The problem with putting a wizard on an empty rock and then adding
> > > a trader and an inn is that the inn would not have enough trade to
> > > keep it going.
> >
> > It depends whether this provides a good place for spelljammers,
> > where there is a lack of one. The groundling equivalent being an
> > inn at the crossroads of two major trade roads, where people
> > previously have thought it too dangerous to create a business. If
> > so, the place is likely to grow.
>
> Don't forget that an inn needs an attached brewery in order to
> make the ale it serves. It also needs some sort of mill to grind
> the hops and other ingredients. You need fields of crops like
> barley and all of the people making this stuff need to also grow
> food. If you have an inn without a community then it is not a
> self supporting thing and the wizard would have to pay for it to
> be constantly supplied by spelljammers.

Ale or wine could be delivered, and some would likely be, to get
a range or drinks. Many inns were their own mini-breweries, I
believe, and you can make things alcholic by fermenting all sorts
of things, probably even infinity vine!

(Does anyone know of any drinks made from infinity vine?)

An inn could exist on it's own, as long as it provides a valuable
enough service, and gets food, drink, and other supplies
delivered. The wizard wouldn't have to pay for these supplies, if
the customers, maybe including lodgers, paid enough to make it a
working business.


> The wizard would want to have food as well. He would either need
> to take up farming, keep travelling to a nearby community to
> stock up with supplies, or pay for someone to fly in and supply
> him.

A good wizard has all sorts of ways of dealing with food and
drink, including spells removing the need for it, having stocks
of elven waybread, and some way of summoning what they need. If
they are willing to do self-delusion, they can make themselves
believe even the blandest food is a mighty feast (think Murlynd's
Spoon). An organised wizard might even have a calendar, to remind
himself of what sort of feast he will have, when! [grin]


> Farming would cut into the wizards spell research time, but might
> be an option if your wizard is fed up with being a wizard.

Having automata means not having to dig, plant, or harvest fields
yourself...

If you want a non-vegetarian diet, from live animals, automata
might not be completely trustworthy looking after these, though.

Salt-cured sides of beef, ham, and mutton, not to mention things
like salted and smoked fish, can last a long time, though. Make
things honey-cured, for a bit of variety.


> Travelling around wildspace stocking up on rations makes your
> wizard more a part of the spelljamming community rather than less
> of a part. He wouldn't be able to cast spells and power the helm,
> so it would be dangerous to do this without a crew to go along
> with you. However, this would stop him being isolated as he would
> then have a bunch of followers with him.

I suspect Grey would have a magic metal boat, which did not
depend on spelljamming, in that it drained all his magic. If not,
maybe he has acquired an alchemical homonculus from somewhere,
that goes in box when he doesn't need it, and works as at least a
1st level magic-user for SJ purposes. If he's as smart a wizard
as I think he is, he will likely be using a Mass Invisibility
spell to avoid his travelling being bothered by anyone he doesn't
want to meet.


> If someone was supplying the wizard he would be dependent on
> them. If their ship got attacked and destroyed, he might starve
> to death. Enlightened self interest would force him to give them
> magical items and spell scrolls in order to enable them to
> protect themselves. And if they ran off he would have lost this
> investment.

Nice plot hooks, but if you want solitude you don't plan to
travel around in dangerous wildspace, or make youself dependant
on the regular shipping in of supplies.

Once there is an inn, and a trader, he might have a favoured ship
that he might equip in this way.


> I think it would be less disruptive to a person who wanted
> solitude, to live at some distance from an existing small
> community that you knew would leave you alone. If I was this
> wizard I'd tour around until I found a bunch of people I thought
> would respect or fear me and then set up shop on part of their
> asteroid that was uninhabitable to them (the top of a small
> mountain, an island in the middle of a lake, etc).

If there are people there already, they probably think this is
their place. And, those who follow Law will likely agree with
them. Also, if you want solitude, you don't want _anyone_ knowing
you are there. Then, the locals might get mercenaries or
adventurers to come bother you, and, even if they respect you,
rumours are sure to get out.

Best to find somewhere uninhabited, hence asking the Brass Head.


> > > Perhaps it would be best for the wizard to find a small spelljamming
> > > community with an area of land that they will let him use. Maybe this
> > > could be some sort of symbiotic relationship.
> > [snip]
> >
> > The reason I didn't do this, was that the wizard thought he
> > wanted solitude, and would avoid communities.
>
> I once saw a talk by Terry Pratchett, where he said that you need
> to give cities a water supply and a place for sewerage to go to
> make them convincing. While these issues are a bit boring from a
> game point of view, they do help stop SJ communities from being 2
> dimensional.

I agree with Mr Pratchett, who (to drop names) I was lucky enough
to chat to in a bar at an SF convention, at one point in the
1990s, I think it was.


> > Good ideas, though.
>
> Thanks.
>
> > > > Realm: is so called because it is the home of a long-fallen liche
> > > > king. His spirit still protects the place, though it is said that
> > > > he long ago lost his physical body. Those knowledgable suggest
> > > > that by mighty enchantments he made the whole world into his
> > > > Magic Jar, and his spirit still reaches out, and listens in on
> > > > those living there, looking through their eyes, but not
> > > > possessing them or controlling their actions. It is said, that,
> > > > often least once a year, someone who is in a drunken stupor,
> > > > stands up, with a strange gleam in their eyes, and shouts "This
> > > > is my Realm!", and then falls over again.
> > >
> > > Again I like this general idea, but not the suggestion of renaming
> > > Realmspace.
> > >
> > > I think you have the beginning of a good idea for a liveworld here. If
> > > you forget about calling it Realm and make the locals forget about the
> > > lich, then you could possibly upgrade his powers and let him actually
> > > take over the bodies of people from time to time.
> > [snip]
> >
> > I thought it was more interesting to have a semi-benevolent
> > liche. One as a secret killer just gives a short-term campaign
> > idea. Now, if there was some sort of _other_ killer, like a
> > demonically possessed Doppleganger, and the PCs had to wake up
> > the liche, and persuade him to be interested enough to help
> > them...
>
> If you want a semi-benevolent lich, then you should make it an
> arch-lich instead. Instead of just getting people to shout
> messages and fall over, you could get him to make people do
> things that benifit the community. If he was weak he might only
> be able to control people when they slept. Perhaps the local
> thief would sleepwalk and return everything he has stolen every
> night. Perhaps a selfish lord with lots of servants will
> sleepwalk and polish all of their shoes. If he was a bit stronger
> he could act as a force of justice or good. He might make an
> assasin drop his knife or fumble a catapult shot. Even if all he
> could do was get people to speak he might be able to make people
> confess to their crimes.
[snip]

Yes, maybe the liche could do this, but initially he's drifted so
far from the concerns of life that all there is left is a faint
curiosity, and an occasional claim of self identity and
ownership. DMs could get the idea to develop in any way they
like, once the liche is a bit more in contact with the world.
Initially, there's only enough power there to use the senses of
others, and maybe animate those who've drunk themselves into
insensibility, not even those sleeping.

As for benevolence, it depends what sort of motivations an
ancient liche has left, after he's achieved a pretty reliable
form of immortality.

I am unsure what you mean by 'arch liche', as while various
people have used variations on 'liche', that's not one I've
previously encountered.


> > I'm not currently ref'ing or playing in any SJ campaigns, and any
> > of the space stuff I'm involved in is SF or using World Gates, so
> > I've limited motivation to do SJ stuff at the moment. My ideas
> > tend to spark off from actual play.
>
> How do the World Gates work? It would be fun if one side of the
> gate needed to be transported by a spelljamming ship.
[snip]

A World Gate can be done lots of ways, but mainly it is a
reliable way of regularly getting from world A to world B,
without doing the spelljamming or planar travel.

The crudest variety is a Teleportal, a higher level spell to a
Teleport that will take you between worlds, but which creates an
opening (maybe only one-way) that stays open for at least a few
seconds, allowing several to pass. Better versions are two-way,
hold the portal open as long as you keep feeding in magical
power, can be made large enough to get a cart through, etc.

Fancier varieties tend to be set up in things like Halls of
Teleportation, and these can reach through inter-world 'weak
spots', preferably to a gate already set up at the other end, but
if necessary can function without this. Talismans that can
communicate inter-world, maybe only by these 'week spots', can
say when you want to go back.

In some cases, spelljamming or planar travel is required to a
world before you can create a World Gate to there. A means of
reading and recording the 'World Aura' is used, and when this is
taken back, it allows a World Gate to be connected to this world.

In some cases, particularly for the lower-powered World Gates, an
actual gate must to taken to a world, or built/ritually enchanted
there. This is a good reason for spelljamming to places, even if
World Gates exist in a given campaign.

Also, typically a World Gate doesn't let you explore a world, and
might not be able to move something large like an intact SJ vessel
through, at least until you've done a lot of work on the other
side.


> David "Big Mac" Shepheard
> Virtual Eclipse Role Playing Club
> http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/virtualeclipselrp/links/d20_system_001071937434/Spelljammer_001071430476
> http://virtualeclipse.aboho.com/

--
Dreamer
dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk
http://www.romsys.demon.co.uk/