Re: Brass heads and wizards - Was: Why is it 'Grey' and 'Realm' space?

From: "Dreamer" <dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk>
Subject: Re: [SPELLJAMMER] Why is it 'Grey' and 'Realm' space?


> In <URL:news:local.spelljam> on Wed 02 Mar, David Shepheard wrote:
> > From: "Dreamer" <dreamer@??????.?????.??.uk>
> > Subject: [SPELLJAMMER] Why is it 'Grey' and 'Realm' space?
>
> > The Brass Head is fun. I'd be interested to see what these devices can
> > do. Does it connect to the mind of a god or outer plane creature?
>
> The idea is from the real world character, Roger Bacon, who
> allegedly made a Brass Head that would answer questions. Some
> sort of advanced Contact Higher Planes would be the easy way to
> make it, maybe connecting to some extra-universal principle of
> Knowledge would be more interesting, with some major ritual
> required. Like you having to construct a new library, of a
> variety not known on that world, and bringing knowledge together
> in a new way.
>
> The original Brass Head (from probably faulty memory) could
> answer three questions, I think one about the past, one the
> present, and one the (possible?) future. But, if you say that you
> can get elaborate answers, and the Head will expand on things it
> has already said, it's a lot more worthwhile using than something
> like Legend Lore.

The (3e) DMG has got some rules about intelligent magical items (and how their ego can
expand and make them want to be in charge). I think that it would be worth you reading
through them. You could turn the brass head into an NPC with its own adgenda. (Have you
ever seen the British sci-fi TV show called Blakes 7? That had a really intelligent, but
really aragant computer in it called Orac. Orac could make a good model for something like
a Brass Head if you wanted to make it taunt players or make them do things for it before
helping.)

> > The problem with putting a wizard on an empty rock and then adding
> > a trader and an inn is that the inn would not have enough trade to
> > keep it going.
>
> It depends whether this provides a good place for spelljammers,
> where there is a lack of one. The groundling equivalent being an
> inn at the crossroads of two major trade roads, where people
> previously have thought it too dangerous to create a business. If
> so, the place is likely to grow.

Don't forget that an inn needs an attached brewery in order to make the ale it serves. It
also needs some sort of mill to grind the hops and other ingredients. You need fields of
crops like barley and all of the people making this stuff need to also grow food. If you
have an inn without a community then it is not a self supporting thing and the wizard
would have to pay for it to be constantly supplied by spelljammers.

The wizard would want to have food as well. He would either need to take up farming, keep
travelling to a nearby community to stock up with supplies, or pay for someone to fly in
and supply him.

Farming would cut into the wizards spell research time, but might be an option if your
wizard is fed up with being a wizard.

Travelling around wildspace stocking up on rations makes your wizard more a part of the
spelljamming community rather than less of a part. He wouldn't be able to cast spells and
power the helm, so it would be dangerous to do this without a crew to go along with you.
However, this would stop him being isolated as he would then have a bunch of followers
with him.

If someone was supplying the wizard he would be dependent on them. If their ship got
attacked and destroyed, he might starve to death. Enlightened self interest would force
him to give them magical items and spell scrolls in order to enable them to protect
themselves. And if they ran off he would have lost this investment.

I think it would be less disruptive to a person who wanted solitude, to live at some
distance from an existing small community that you knew would leave you alone. If I was
this wizard I'd tour around until I found a bunch of people I thought would respect or
fear me and then set up shop on part of their asteroid that was uninhabitable to them (the
top of a small mountain, an island in the middle of a lake, etc).

> > Perhaps it would be best for the wizard to find a small spelljamming
> > community with an area of land that they will let him use. Maybe this
> > could be some sort of symbiotic relationship.
> [snip]
>
> The reason I didn't do this, was that the wizard thought he
> wanted solitude, and would avoid communities.

I once saw a talk by Terry Pratchett, where he said that you need to give cities a water
supply and a place for sewerage to go to make them convincing. While these issues are a
bit boring from a game point of view, they do help stop SJ communities from being 2
dimensional.

> Good ideas, though.

Thanks.

> > > Realm: is so called because it is the home of a long-fallen liche
> > > king. His spirit still protects the place, though it is said that
> > > he long ago lost his physical body. Those knowledgable suggest
> > > that by mighty enchantments he made the whole world into his
> > > Magic Jar, and his spirit still reaches out, and listens in on
> > > those living there, looking through their eyes, but not
> > > possessing them or controlling their actions. It is said, that,
> > > often least once a year, someone who is in a drunken stupor,
> > > stands up, with a strange gleam in their eyes, and shouts "This
> > > is my Realm!", and then falls over again.
> >
> > Again I like this general idea, but not the suggestion of renaming
> > Realmspace.
> >
> > I think you have the beginning of a good idea for a liveworld here. If
> > you forget about calling it Realm and make the locals forget about the
> > lich, then you could possibly upgrade his powers and let him actually
> > take over the bodies of people from time to time.
> [snip]
>
> I thought it was more interesting to have a semi-benevolent
> liche. One as a secret killer just gives a short-term campaign
> idea. Now, if there was some sort of _other_ killer, like a
> demonically possessed Doppleganger, and the PCs had to wake up
> the liche, and persuade him to be interested enough to help
> them...

If you want a semi-benevolent lich, then you should make it an arch-lich instead. Instead
of just getting people to shout messages and fall over, you could get him to make people
do things that benifit the community. If he was weak he might only be able to control
people when they slept. Perhaps the local thief would sleepwalk and return everything he
has stolen every night. Perhaps a selfish lord with lots of servants will sleepwalk and
polish all of their shoes. If he was a bit stronger he could act as a force of justice or
good. He might make an assasin drop his knife or fumble a catapult shot. Even if all he
could do was get people to speak he might be able to make people confess to their crimes.

> I was hoping to provide a few leads to solving a problem. These
> will go on the backburner unless there is some reason otherwise.
> Which, with Dysonspace to work on, seems unlikely at the moment.

Dysonspace is more important. I think you should finish that first.

> > If we can pick things like Dragon Rock, that are already named, but not
> > well documented by TSR, then we can create three Brallike places that
> > seem to maintain continuity with the 2e version of Spelljammer. I'll
> > have to look through those SJML archives of Dragon Rock as it sounds
> > like a good choice.
>
> The idea was that these could have the name, and maybe be
> developed to be as good for trade as Bral, killing two birds with
> one stone.

I think it is better to use existing places like Dragon Rock to be the iconic places than
come up with a new location that can cause continuity problems with the sphere name. If
you bring in places called Grey and Realm, you are going to get all sort of nuts
complaining that you "made a mistake" when you put it on the web.

> > Ideally I'd like to see all three spheres work (from a SJ point of view)
> > without the groundling nations. But I'd also like to see the groundling
> > worlds kept there so that people that want to do crossover games can also
> > use these spheres as a way to do that.
> [snip]
>
> That's what I was proposing!
>
> I thought.

I love most of your ideas, just not the idea of reinventing the reasons for the names of
the sphere. That is not necesary.

> I'm not currently ref'ing or playing in any SJ campaigns, and any
> of the space stuff I'm involved in is SF or using World Gates, so
> I've limited motivation to do SJ stuff at the moment. My ideas
> tend to spark off from actual play.

How do the World Gates work? It would be fun if one side of the gate needed to be
transported by a spelljamming ship.

> Given a long-running interest in space travel, I'd like to see SJ
> work, as I think it is an important addition to fantasy gaming,
> but...

I'm heavily into sci-fi games and I always have to remind myself that SJ is not a sci-fi
setting. The fact that Spelljammer is "fantasy space" is the thing that makes the setting
unique. I think the only other setting that I've seen that treats space in a special way
is Space 1899.

I think the best thing you could do for SJ, at the moment, is get your Dysonsphere
finished and stick it online for other people to play with.

David "Big Mac" Shepheard
Virtual Eclipse Role Playing Club
http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/virtualeclipselrp/links/d20_system_001071937434/Spelljammer_001071430476
http://virtualeclipse.aboho.com/